326

Re: Nuncabola

Nuncabola 0.142-0.144

In 2009, shino wrote:

Of course Tiger is a bit obsolete (2 years) but it's still quite used. Personnaly I use it and I won't upgrade to Leopard or Snow Leopard as I don't need too.

tonesfrommars wrote:

Anyone with a pre-intel mac (including me) will find it impractical to upgrade to 10.5 and higher, as these OS's are designed specifically for these much faster newer machines. In another 2-3 years, most of those users will have migrated I think.

shino, tones, in case you're reading this, given that the three years cited above have passed now, is Mac OS X 10.4 compatibility still an issue for you? It's likely that once LWJGL (the multimedia library I'm using) gains support for Java 7 runtime environments on Mac, getting it to run on Tiger will no longer be possible. From what I've read, Steam requires at least 10.5.8, too.

327

Re: Nuncabola

Elviz wrote:

shino, tones, in case you're reading this, given that the three years cited above have passed now, is Mac OS X 10.4 compatibility still an issue for you?

Personally it's no more an issue for me since 2 years ago, and I'm running 10.7 at the moment. Tiger is very old now (7 years old is a long time speaking of operating systems), and lots of software are not compatible anymore because of outdated libraries. A compatibility with 10.5 has to be maintain though as it is still widely used and shouldn't take a lot of effort, but I don't think Java 7 is supported before 10.7 ...

328 (edited by Cheeseness 2012-09-23 06:18:18)

Re: Nuncabola

My Macintoshes are all still PPC, and though I have no interests in migrating to an Intel Mac at this stage, I'll say that it's OK to drop explicit MacOS 10.4 support.

This is a Free Software project. If anybody with enthusiasm enough wants to downgrade LWJGL and do a PPC fork of Nuncabola, then they have the "freedom" to do so. I think with the timeframes involved, the sad reality is that it's more effort than it's worth to provide legacy Mac support.

It wouldn't hurt to keep older releases and source snapshots available though.

Cheese
==========
cheesetalks.net

329 (edited by Elviz 2012-09-25 07:49:32)

Re: Nuncabola

shino wrote:

A compatibility with 10.5 has to be maintain though as it is still widely used and shouldn't take a lot of effort, but I don't think Java 7 is supported before 10.7 ...

I'm not actually planning to move the Nuncabola codebase to Java 7 (in terms of language and API use) at this time, and I think LWJGL will also stay compatible with Java 6 for a while. The issue is just that in order to run on OpenJDK 7 on Mac, the LWJGL developers need to rewrite the OS X implementation of their library, and it's this endeavour that may result in support being dropped for older Macs. See these threads (1, 2) for more information, including a discussion on OS X versions.

330

Re: Nuncabola

Nuncabola 0.145-0.147

  • Changed term "Standard mode" back to Neverball's "Normal mode" (found out that Super Monkey Ball has a "Normal mode", too)

  • Data folder update (<= Neverball r3863)

331 (edited by themacmeister 2012-10-23 01:25:21)

Re: Nuncabola

Couldn't take a screenshot, but first three text labels are missing under Options.

ie: Graphics, etc. going down left.

ie: -----------    Configure...
    ------------    themacmeister
    ------------

Latest build with Win7 64bit.

I'll try and get a better screenshot next time!

Currently Playing:
Celeste and Electronic Super Joy

332

Re: Nuncabola

themacmeister wrote:

Couldn't take a screenshot, but first three text labels are missing under Options.

That's weird, as I didn't make any notable changes to that part of the code or related ones recently. Since you wrote that you have a Radeon 7750 now, I'm wondering whether this could be another spooky effect caused by some behaviour of the AMD drivers.

I'll try and get a better screenshot next time!

If that's possible, it would be most helpful, because I'm not sure I'm reading your ASCII art correctly. (The new screenshot key is F12.)

333

Re: Nuncabola

I believe I hit F12, so it must have placed it somewhere "special"

Currently Playing:
Celeste and Electronic Super Joy

334

Re: Nuncabola

The screenshot should be in %APPDATA%\Nuncabola\Screenshots. If not, could you try again?

335

Re: Nuncabola

That .bat file is still not working under Win7 64bit. I know I discussed this with you, but have you thought of changing this in the release version?

Currently Playing:
Celeste and Electronic Super Joy

336

Re: Nuncabola

Here is the screenshot, I found it in AppData/Roaming/Nuncabola/Screenshots I think

http://i.imgur.com/507VL.png

You will be pleased to know that the missing items (on identical hd/os) are there under latest NVIDIA drivers. Looks like an AMD specific bug (if any bug at all).

Currently Playing:
Celeste and Electronic Super Joy

337

Re: Nuncabola

I'm getting the same problem with my AMD drivers. Some of the level numbers in the level select screen are missing too. I'm beginning to really hate AMD now.

338 (edited by themacmeister 2012-10-30 08:02:04)

Re: Nuncabola

I agree Static, AMD Drivers SUCK B*LLS

I was using 12.9, which was the latest "STABLE" drivers

Edit: I tried 12.10 and 12.11beta as well -- sheesh!

Currently Playing:
Celeste and Electronic Super Joy

339

Re: Nuncabola

Yeah, could be a driver bug. Looks like it, anyway.

Then again, AMD is a major graphics card vendor, Windows is a major platform, and Nuncabola and Neverball don't really use any bleeding-edge OpenGL features. You'd expect everything to just work in this scenario. So one other possibility I can think of is that there might be some kind of incorrect GL usage in the code that NVIDIA tolerates but AMD no longer does. (There was a similar case over at the LWJGL forum recently.)

BTW, I've been unable to find any changes between 0.141 and 0.147 that would explain why the former version works for Static Juice while the latter doesn't. It's still a mystery.

340

Re: Nuncabola

Incorrect GL usage may be revealed by checking glGetError, say, once a frame. You might want to make it a config option to avoid a possible performance hit.

I have yet to see Neverball screenshots that show graphical problems, though. So far only macmeister has come through with a Nuncabola screenshot (sadly without a comparable Neverball screenshot). The one Static Juice posted of Neverball didn't actually show anything out of the ordinary, aside from disabled reflection and a hidden HUD both of which can be disabled purposefully.

341 (edited by jammnrose 2012-10-30 13:11:26)

Re: Nuncabola

I have an AMD Radeon HD 6970M on a 27" iMac. No issues here.

I can test in windows sometime too, as I have BootCamp setup.

Mac OS X Xcode project & package maintainer.

If you have some Neverball related files you need hosted somewhere, please send a me forum PM/email.

342 (edited by Elviz 2012-10-30 14:33:06)

Re: Nuncabola

parasti wrote:

Incorrect GL usage may be revealed by checking glGetError, say, once a frame. You might want to make it a config option to avoid a possible performance hit.

Actually, this is already possible, though not controlled directly by Nuncabola. If -Dorg.lwjgl.util.Debug=true is passed as an argument to the JVM, LWJGL will call glGetError when swapping the buffers and throw an exception upon encountering an error. This exception will then end up in Nuncabola's error log.

(However, while this will catch outright errors such as invalid function arguments, I'm not sure it'll pick up more subtle problems caused by unintentionally relying on some behaviour that isn't guaranteed by the GL specification.)

343

Re: Nuncabola

I have 4670 on my iMac, and it was fine until I updated Java. Now I can't play Nuncabola, and have reverted to the new Mac OS X build of Neverball. Certainly looks like AMD dropped the (Windows) ball.

Currently Playing:
Celeste and Electronic Super Joy

344

Re: Nuncabola

themacmeister wrote:

I have 4670 on my iMac, and it was fine until I updated Java. Now I can't play Nuncabola [...]

Sounds like a different problem? Nuncabola does not yet work with Java 7 on Mac OS X, if that's the issue here.

345

Re: Nuncabola

Java 7 on Mac OS X is in a sorry state of affairs, at least when it comes to working with the lwjgl library. I know Minecraft has the same issues.

Mac OS X Xcode project & package maintainer.

If you have some Neverball related files you need hosted somewhere, please send a me forum PM/email.

346 (edited by Elviz 2012-10-31 20:12:35)

Re: Nuncabola

Nuncabola 0.148

  • Don't make content drawing calls for empty text widgets

  • Data folder update (<= Neverball r3873)

One thing that is striking about themacmeister's screenshot is that when you consider the bottom-to-top widget drawing order, the missing labels are in each case preceded by an empty text widget (the last in a series of slider buttons which, of course, are empty on purpose). An empty text widget uses the default texture, and the content section of its VBO is zeroed out. While it's not clear how exactly drawing it in this state could cause trouble, it seems like a good idea not to bother in the first place, so 0.148 no longer does that. It's kind of a long shot, but please let me know if this improves things.

347 (edited by themacmeister 2012-11-01 06:57:34)

Re: Nuncabola

The 32bit/64bit loading bug seems to be fixed (with workaround code)

http://lwjgl.org/forum/index.php?PHPSES … 585.0.html

Trying the 64bit Win and OSX nightly builds tonight!

Currently Playing:
Celeste and Electronic Super Joy

348

Re: Nuncabola

Make sure to check if Nuncabola 0.148 fixes the config screen glitch on AMD.

349

Re: Nuncabola

will test it soon, bit busy at the moment.

Currently Playing:
Celeste and Electronic Super Joy

350

Re: Nuncabola

I just tried "java -jar nuncabola.jar" from the terminal, in the Nuncabola directory, using Oracle Java 7 with latest nightly Mac OS X build of liblwjgl.jnilib, and it works perfectly (Mac OS X 10.7.5) in 64bit

http://i.imgur.com/FZS4J.jpg?1

Going to use Platypus to create a launcher now smile

Currently Playing:
Celeste and Electronic Super Joy